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Maroons1972

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Jun. 16, 2023
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Montreal Canadiens
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Forum: NHL TradesFeb. 3 at 9:06 a.m.
Thread: (MTL/WPG) - Monahan for 2024 1st (WPG), 2027 3rd (WPG)
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>turtlemountain</b></div><div>Now that’s just not true lol</div></div>

When you say it's not true... You base yourself on what stats?
Both players arrived in the league in 2013 and until 2018 they both played on different teams with Lindholm stats not coming close to Monahan stats
Then in 2018-2019 they were both for the flames and even if it was close, Monahan still had better stats.
Its only in 2019-2020 that Lindholm finally passed Monahan and we know at that point he was starting to be slowed and still managed to do better in the playoffs
Then it was downhill for Monahan which explains how the habs got him for free and a first pick.

Now that he is healthy, even with 2nd and 3rd line duties with no help on the wings he is doing better than Lindholm.

I'm not saying that Monahan will be a superstar but if Lindholm brought a 1st, a 3rd, Kuzmenko and 2 prospect including a top D, The habs should've had slightly more.
I understand it's luck and Monahan could've been injured again and we would've got nothing.
Hopefully he will help the Jets for a good push even if this means a bad pick for the habs
Forum: NHL TradesFeb. 2 at 5:27 p.m.
Thread: (MTL/WPG) - Monahan for 2024 1st (WPG), 2027 3rd (WPG)
I think this is a fair trade as both team get what they are looking for.

If you compare the trade to similar ones, we could've gotten a bit more:
Lindholm: gave a 1st and a 4th and 3 players including Kuzmenko and Brzustewicz to Calgary
When healthy Monahan is better than Lindholm but this is when he is healthy

Before we can really confirm 100% who is the winner we need to see what Kent will do with the picks
We gave a 1st (13th overall) and 3rd for Dach who had a history of injuries and it didn't change once he joined the habs
We also gave a 1st and 2nd for Newhook who also isn't better than Monahan.

All this is behind us now and hopefully Kent can get rid of Anderson, Armia, Dvorak even if for peanuts and let the young players play and adapt to the NHL speed and see what we really have on hands

C: Suzuki, Dach, Kidney, Beck, Kapanen, Evans and Davidson - Dach can move to #1 RW and Suzuki #1 Center. The others can fight for #3 and #4 and we need a #2 Center.
LW: Caufield, Newhook, Roy, Heineman, Pinard, Tuch and Pezzetta - Caufield is #1 LW, the others can fight for #3 and #4 LW or RW and we need a #2 LW
RW: Slafkovsky, Ylonen, Mesar - Dach and Slaf can be #1 and #2 and Mesar and Ylonen can fight for #4
D: Guhle, Matheson, Hutson, Reinbacher, Xhekaj, Struble, Kovacevic, Barron, Mailloux and Harris - We should be good on D.

We have enough young players but many gaps and no real superstar. Hopefully one of them will be close.
With 4 first round picks in the next 2 years and too many young players for the bottom 6. If Kent really want to be a magician, then he needs to fill in the gaps in the next 2 years.

The Habs were supposed to lose last year and put themselves in a position to draft in the top 3 to fill the offense with a top prospect. We dropped to #5 and picked a D while the need is in the front or in net.
We should also be losing this year but we will end up with a pick between 5 and 10. In a D heavy draft, it will be hard to fill the offensive gaps.

Therefore to finish the rebuild faster, we need to turn to the trading market.
What would it cost to get one or two from : Zegras, Turcotte, Holloway....

We have a 5 year window, with the first couple years to fill in the gap and the next 3 to develop chemistry and hopefully get far enough in playoffs.

What do you think could be a good next move ?
Forum: Montreal CanadiensOct. 20, 2023 at 6:32 p.m.
Thread: Kirby Dach is out for the season. What now?
Like CBA said, losing Dach will hurt but the team is in the middle of reconstruction so we weren't going to win the cup this year
The plan was a 5 year rebuild and we are in year 3.
Is Dach going to recover from a knee injury, he might, is he going to be the same, not sure
Since 2019, he got a concussion, wrist injury, shoulder injury and now a knee injury. Poor kid but he really isn't lucky.

Hoping Kent has a good solid plan because we have a farm full of prospects that we won't be able to sign. Hopefully he will be able to pick that missing top 6 superstar that will help us get closer to a Cup.
I think on Defense with Guhle, Matheson, Mailloux, Reinbacher, Hutson we will be solid for many years
We are missing a #1 or 2 Center and a Goalie
In the front we have Suzuki, Caufield, Pinard, Roy, Newhook, Slafkovsky, Heineman, Mesar, Kidney, Kapanen. Not bad but 1 or 2 power forwards and we will be dangerous
Forum: Montreal CanadiensOct. 16, 2023 at 4:18 p.m.
Thread: Should Montreal Draft More French Canadian ? Taking a deep look into 2013-2023 NHL Drafts
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>Maroons1972</b></div><div>Yes the fans don't want to trade him
But in his breakout year 38pts in 58games = 0.66pts/gm which is still lower than PLD production and he broke down again
Anyhow, it's too late for PLD, lets just hope Dach can stay healthy. but 4 NHL seasons and not one complete, it not good. Especially that when you reach playoffs it's even tougher

Not saying that Dach is not good, but many factors come into play when building a Team. How many players with big potential saw their career shortened by Injury. Best example is Lemieux
If he would've remained healthy no one would be talking about the Great Gretzky.</div></div>

Oh Well!!! It didn't take to much time. Dach is on LTR
Forum: Montreal CanadiensAug. 25, 2023 at 11:32 a.m.
Thread: Should Montreal Draft More French Canadian ? Taking a deep look into 2013-2023 NHL Drafts
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>CBA</b></div><div>But Dach broke out last season with Montreal
This is why Habs fans don't want to trade him</div></div>

Yes the fans don't want to trade him
But in his breakout year 38pts in 58games = 0.66pts/gm which is still lower than PLD production and he broke down again
Anyhow, it's too late for PLD, lets just hope Dach can stay healthy. but 4 NHL seasons and not one complete, it not good. Especially that when you reach playoffs it's even tougher

Not saying that Dach is not good, but many factors come into play when building a Team. How many players with big potential saw their career shortened by Injury. Best example is Lemieux
If he would've remained healthy no one would be talking about the Great Gretzky.
Forum: Montreal CanadiensAug. 25, 2023 at 9:28 a.m.
Thread: Should Montreal Draft More French Canadian ? Taking a deep look into 2013-2023 NHL Drafts
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>CBA</b></div><div>There was no way MTL could land PLD without trading Kirby Dach, which was a non-starter
PLD just wanted the bag, and LA offered him</div></div>

I agree that it might of cost the habs Dach, and only time will tell which of the two is best. But for now :
Dach: 6'4'' 212 lbs 22yo 4 NHL seasons 210games 97pts = 0.46pts/gm and -24 Playoffs 6 pts in 9 games
PLD: 6'3'' 218lbs 25yo 7NHL seasons 434 games 302pts = 0.7pts/gm and +13 Playoffs 26pts in 38games Team Canada: 27games 27pts and +25

On paper PLD is way superior 7 good NHL seasons, consistent. Dach one good season in 4 years and not one season over 70 games (injury prone player)

Comparison will be difficult as both LA and the Habs are different teams with different goals. LA is in win now with players on the verge of retirement and Habs are finishing a rebuild but we will see who stays healthy and who helps his team

But like i said above, you take the best player available French or not but if you insist on having French players, PLD vs Dach or Newhook, i take PLD and he is French so 2 birds with one stone
Maybe his contract seems high but if he maintains his scoring pace he will be cheap at 8.5M$
Forum: Montreal CanadiensAug. 24, 2023 at 2:29 p.m.
Thread: Should Montreal Draft More French Canadian ? Taking a deep look into 2013-2023 NHL Drafts
I also agree with the fact that you pick the BPA or that fits the plan, French or Other.
Nice job on your research but we can also do the same and pull all the French that were drafted high and did not bring the talent to NHL level
Daigle, Chouinard, Ouellette, Drouin, Morin, Gauthier, Poirier..... Just to name a few. Or if you prefer the latest Lafrenière instead of Stutzle, Byfield, Raymond...

The habs did lose one great opportunity to get a Frenchman recently by letting Dubois slip. We will never know if he really wanted to play in Montreal or what Hughes offered to try to get him. All i know is we gave a 1st and a 2nd pick for Dvorak, a 1st and a second for Newhook and a 1st for Dach. If we only take the two 1st round pics of Dach and Newhook and it would've most probably brought Dubois to MTL.

Nice post, but at the end, the managers have a business to run, French or not, they owe their fans the best teams on the ice
Forum: Montreal CanadiensJul. 22, 2023 at 11:06 a.m.
Thread: If MTL offered a similar package than LA for Dubois
I tend to disagree
Yes you need to build a team for the long run with the draft, but when players like Dubois become available, you don't miss your chance of getting them especially if you are part of where the players want to play. There are not tons of NHL players that want to come and play in Montreal due to pressure from media and fans.
Talk about it to Martin St-Louis and Vincent Lecavalier, if they would've came in their prime years to Montreal.
Now if we look at your poll.
The habs gave a 1st and 2nd round for Newhook, that does not come close to Dubois and that also does not help the team with their goal of getting bigger and stronger.
The only player in your poll that will bring a debate is Dach.
Lets see what Dach did in his career on a Team loaded with talent
in 2019-2020: In Chicago 23pts in 64games = 0.36ppg and they had Kane, Toews, DeBrincat, Strome, Saad...
2020-2021: Only played 18games but managed 10pts, which is decent but again well surrounded
2021-2022: he had 26pts in 70games = 0.37ppg with Kane 92pts, Debrincat 78pts, Jones 51pts, Strome 48pts....
In 3 seasons in Chicago: he had 59pts in 152games = 0.39ppg and -22
2022-2023: in MTL he had a good season but got injured 38pts in 58games = .66ppg and -2
in his NHL career he has 97pts in 210 games = .47 and -24

Without going in too much details for Newhook
66pts in 159 games = .41ppg and only 4 points in 12 playoff games the year Colorado won the Cup.

So for Dach and Newhook, the habs gave 2 first round pics, a 2nd round pick and a 3rd round pick

But weren't willing to give something slightly less to get Dubois 6'3'' 218lbs, key player with Columbus and the Jets with 302pts in 434 games = 0.7ppg and +13 and producing 26points in 38 playoff games

Its ridiculous to say that he wouldn't be a good addition.

The guy brings size, strength, production as a real top 6 center. You get a great pair in Suzuki and Dubois for years to come.

Hughes missed a big time opportunity here.

He tries to hit home runs on every single trade but who cares, as long as you have a plan and you are building a team based on that plan, some players will cost you.
Look at Vegas, they gave us Tatar and Suzuki for Pacioretty but then gave him away. Then payed again for Stone and Eichel. Result, they lost on almost every trade they made, but they are Stanley Cup Champions.

We have a dynasty that hasn't won in over 30 years and we have one of the best pool of prospects but no super star in the horizon
Too many similar players that you can't all sign and we will wait until they lose value to trade them.

We need to get bigger and fast
more than half of your top 9 are below 5'10'' and these are not old or on the verge of retirement
Colefield: 5'7''
Gallagher: 5'9''
Newhook: 5'10''
Farrell: 5'9''
Pinard' 5'9''

You can't win with too many small players. One or two max.

Look at my other post and you will see how the teams that won the cup in the last years how they are built.

I understand the Habs won't win in the next 3 to 4 years, but where are the pieces to be ready in 5 while Suzuki, Caufield, Guhle, Matheson, Barron are still in their prime

The only top 6 palyers coming are Mesar and Kidney, the rest are good for bottom 6 in Bech, Roy, Mysak, Kapanen, Davidson

Too late now for Dubois but hopefully the next player of that caliber that becomes available, we don't stay greedy
Forum: Montreal CanadiensJul. 20, 2023 at 12:34 a.m.
Thread: Habs chances of winning a cup in next 4 years and work done by Kent Hughes
Hello All,

I would like to know what you guys think of the chances of the habs to win a cup in next 4 years and the work of Kent Hughes

With one of the best draft class in many years, Kent and the Canadian management decided to trade a 1st and 2nd round pick for Newhook.
Since in position, Kent is trying to hit a home run on every trade and its hard to understand the plan behind his moves.
We can all agree that getting Monahan for free and a first round pick was a great move, same goes for the acquisition of Kirby Dach.
The one trade he should've done was for Dubois. Many think the Kings over paid, but players like this just don't become available especially at 25.
After missing the playoff many times and trading players for draft picks. We have one of the best pool of prospects but no superstar on the horizon.
So giving draft pics or prospects for an established player was a no brainer.
Yes Dach is a top 3 pick but not all players bring the talent to the NHL (Galchen, Kotkaniemi, Leblanc....) and in 4 season in the NHL, wasn't able to play a whole season.
Monahan, is a great player, but also always injured...

I read that if the 2019 draft would be redone and the Habs would draft Dach, Caufield and Newhook, the fans would all be happy.
The problem is not with each player taken individually. But with the plan.

If you look at the teams that won the Stanly cup in the last 9 - 10 years
Chi: Amazing offense with Kane, Toews, Panarin, Sharp, Saad,... Defense: Seabrook, Hjalmarsson, Keith. Kane smallest player a 5'10'' surrounded by monsters
2X Pitt: Crosby, Malkin, Kessel, Hornqvist, Dupuis, Kunitz...Letang, Fleury. Same here team built for the playoffs with no player under 5'11''
Wash: Ovechkin, Backs, Kuzn, Oshie, Eller, Wilson, Stephenson...Carlson, Orlov, Holtby, Grubauer No player under 6'0''
St-L: O'Reilly, Tara, Schenn, Perron, Bozak, Maroon, Pietrangelo, Bouwmeester, Edmunston, Bennington
2xTB: Kucherov, Stamkos, Point, Palat, Cirelli, MAroon, Hedman, Sergy, McDo, Shat, Vasy. Power House
Colorado: Rantanen, Mankinnon, Kadri, Bura, Lendes, Compher, Maker, Byram,...
VG: Stone, Eichel, Marches, Stephenson, Smith, Big D and surprising Goalie

The teams are built on skills, speed, grit and great D.

If we look at our top 9:
Suzuki: 5'11'
Caufield' 5'7''
Dach:6"4''
Gallagher: 5'9''
Pinard: 5'9''
Newhook: 5'10''
Anderson: 6'3''
Monahan: 6'2''
Dvorak: 6'1''

More than half the team is too small, its one thing to have 1 or 2 players well protected but when half your team is too small, its not good for playoffs
If they manage to get to the playoffs, who will be the pest in your face player (Wilson, Stone, Kadri, Maroon...) . Their bigger players are injury prone in Monahan and Dach and Anderson runs like a chicken with no head.

The future players: Slafkovsky, Bech, Mesar, Roy, Farrell, Kidney, are very good but Hughes missed a golden occasion to let go some of them for a proven player who is also French.
With Dubois on the roster, the line up becomes totally transformed and he also removes some of the stress from the Suzuki line.

Its too late now, but hopefully Hughes has a big plan but i am not seeing it.
The other GMs are not idiots. Some of them are stuck with the salary cap but they are not stupid. We should stop with the homeruns and learn from the other teams
We are a dynasty but our last cup is more than 30 years ago.

Your comments are appreciated
Forum: Montreal CanadiensJun. 16, 2023 at 5:27 p.m.
Thread: Habs Roster Analysis
Hi Everyone,
This might be long, but it's my first post and would like to know what you guys think of the following.
Many fans play the GM role and think they would do better than their favorite team management but in reality we all know the job isn't simple even if sometimes some decisions make us go crazy.
That being said, with the draft knocking at the door, many trade rumors go around and the one that makes me wonder is the one that says the habs should trade up to go get Fantilli. Lets look at the habs roster but only the ones worth talking about (no Hoffman, Drouin, Gally...)

Suzuki, C, 5'11'', 23, Good 1st line
Caufield, LW, 5'7'',22, Good 1st line
Dach, C/RW, 6'4'', 22, Good 2nd line
Anderson, RW, 6'3'', 29, Average 2nd line
Slafkovsky, LW, 6'3'', 19, High Potential but for now good 3rd line
Dvorak, C, 6'1'', 27, Could do better but for now average 3rd line
Farrell, LW, 5'9'', 21, Some potential but good 3rd line
Harvey-Pinard, LW, 5'9'', 24, some potential but average 3rd line

4 out of the top 8 are too small. I know, I know, not all small players are bad (Marchessault, St-Louis, DeBrincat,...) but when you have 4 on your Team it's not great either.

Then there's the young prospects that will be knocking at the door
Beck, C, 6'0'', 19, Average Potential 3rd Line
Roy, RW, 6'0'', 19, Potential 2nd line but great 3rd line
Kidney, C, 6'0'', 20, 3rd to 4th line
Mesar, RW, 5'10'', 19, potential 2nd line but great 3rd line
Kapanen, C, 6'1'', 19, 4th line

Looking at this roster we see a good first pair with Suzuki and Caufiled and tons on players that can play key roles on 2nd line but are better suited for 3rd and 4th line.
Between Suzuki, Dach, Dvorak, Beck, Kapanen and with the probable acquisition of Dubois (who will cost less than Fantilli) we have a good group of centers
But if we look at LW: Caufield, Slaf, Farrell and Harvey-Pinard
If we are to sacrifice the 5th overall pick, i would do it to accelerate the rebuild and acquire an established LW (Nylander, Keller, Connor,...) I know its easier said than done but when you have 2 first round picks and a good pool of prospects, i am sure we can find a Deal
Then at RW: Dach, Anderson, Armia, Pitlick, Not the best either but we can pick up a player on UFA list: Bunting, Compher, Bertuzzi, Barbashev...

Lines would be
Caufield, Suzuki, DAch
Nylander, Dubois, Anderson
Slaf, Dvorak, Bunting
Farrell, Evans, Armia

In the Future, Roy can replace Anderson, Beck to replace Dvorak and hopefully Mesar turn out to be good and we can be dangerous in 3-4 years.

So no Fantilli, but we are 3 or 4 additions (Dubois, Nylander, Bunting,...)

On the defense we are good with Guhle, Barron, Matheson, Savard, Xhekaj, Kovacevic, Hutson, Harris...

We might need a good goaltender but with great offense and defense, you can get the cup as well, look at Vegas, who expected that from Hill.

What do you guys think