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Leafs 2024 2025 Offseason Discussion Part 1: Kill or Be Killed

May 10 at 10:33 p.m.
#51
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Quoting: NorthernLeafsFan05
MBN at 23 would genuinely be one of the drafts biggest steals. Fingers crossed he drops that low


It'll be tight but it's looking like an option... so long as Detroit's affinity for Swedes doesn't extend to Norwegians
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May 11 at 12:35 a.m.
#52
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I have no clue what a Marner trade is going to look like. Not really sure what teams are fits. I like the idea of adding another 1st rounder this year, it would be lovely to walk away from this draft having solved our center and defense issues in the long term.

I really like the idea of adding guys like Josh Doan and Jack McBain (among other pieces of course), and it does seem like Utah will want to compete immediately. I don't hate the idea of Doan and pick #6, granted I don't think Arizona would love that. Doan and Dicky for Mitch would be a fine deal. Plus, it would be neat to see Josh join his Dad in Toronto now that his chance to play in AZ is gone
May 11 at 1:42 a.m.
#53
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Quoting: NorthernLeafsFan05
I have no clue what a Marner trade is going to look like. Not really sure what teams are fits. I like the idea of adding another 1st rounder this year, it would be lovely to walk away from this draft having solved our center and defense issues in the long term.

I really like the idea of adding guys like Josh Doan and Jack McBain (among other pieces of course), and it does seem like Utah will want to compete immediately. I don't hate the idea of Doan and pick #6, granted I don't think Arizona would love that. Doan and Dicky for Mitch would be a fine deal. Plus, it would be neat to see Josh join his Dad in Toronto now that his chance to play in AZ is gone


If I was to guess in fantasy land if we could somehow pull off a sign and trade something like what Eichel or Tkachuck got

But my reality fear is its gonna look like Guentzel. Meh picks, a lesser player, and then gamble on 4 mid B level prospects.


Still to me Marner trade needs to be player based due to this team having a 4 year window and our young forward group is getting a bit crowded lul

Cowen, Minten, Grebybokin, Robertson, Dewar, Knies, Holmberg, etc
May 11 at 3:26 a.m.
#54
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What Van did is what Brad should eye this summer especially the Dcore

Brought in a new coach

Revamped the Dcore

Out went Schenn, OEL, Burroughs

In came Cole, Hronek (trade), Zadorov (trade), Soucy

And brought in some nice pieces to fill in bottom 6

Lindholm, Suter, Lafferty, etc

So far so good for them and that third line especially is something we could use rn
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May 11 at 7:23 a.m.
#55
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Quoting: NorthernLeafsFan05
I have no clue what a Marner trade is going to look like. Not really sure what teams are fits. I like the idea of adding another 1st rounder this year, it would be lovely to walk away from this draft having solved our center and defense issues in the long term.

I really like the idea of adding guys like Josh Doan and Jack McBain (among other pieces of course), and it does seem like Utah will want to compete immediately. I don't hate the idea of Doan and pick #6, granted I don't think Arizona would love that. Doan and Dicky for Mitch would be a fine deal. Plus, it would be neat to see Josh join his Dad in Toronto now that his chance to play in AZ is gone


6 for Marner could 100% be Sam Dickinson.
Gib
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May 11 at 8:42 a.m.
#56
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Quoting: NorthernLeafsFan05
I have no clue what a Marner trade is going to look like. Not really sure what teams are fits. I like the idea of adding another 1st rounder this year, it would be lovely to walk away from this draft having solved our center and defense issues in the long term.

I really like the idea of adding guys like Josh Doan and Jack McBain (among other pieces of course), and it does seem like Utah will want to compete immediately. I don't hate the idea of Doan and pick #6, granted I don't think Arizona would love that. Doan and Dicky for Mitch would be a fine deal. Plus, it would be neat to see Josh join his Dad in Toronto now that his chance to play in AZ is gone


I'd wonder if BT would try to model it after the Tkachuk deal. Don't think he'd get as high end players back, but maybe something along the lines of (and I know Marner probably wouldn't waive for Ottawa, this is just an example) Batherson, Chychrun, Bos 1st
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May 11 at 12:35 p.m.
#57
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Quoting: LeafsFanForSomeReason
I'd wonder if BT would try to model it after the Tkachuk deal. Don't think he'd get as high end players back, but maybe something along the lines of (and I know Marner probably wouldn't waive for Ottawa, this is just an example) Batherson, Chychrun, Bos 1st


Yea I feel it would probs look like either the Eichel deal or Tkachuck deal

A more player based return

He would need to do a sign and trade to make it happen but its doable
May 11 at 1:49 p.m.
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Prediction: Leafs land one or both of Zadorov and Tanev this summer. BT was supposedly trying hard for the pair

Secondary part of the prediction: Z will be for way too much/too long, but Tanev will be a reasonable number but with more than ideal term (3-4y) cause he’s a Toronto boy
May 11 at 2:01 p.m.
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Edited May 12 at 10:58 p.m.
Quoting: LeafsFanForSomeReason
Prediction: Leafs land one or both of Zadorov and Tanev this summer. BT was supposedly trying hard for the pair

Secondary part of the prediction: Z will be for way too much/too long, but Tanev will be a reasonable number but with more than ideal term (3-4y) cause he’s a Toronto boy


Tanev I could see as when you think of the kinds of Dman Rielly works best with he immediately comes to mind

Zadorov im not so sure as basically why go target a 3rd pair Dman whose gonna cost 5m. With the tight cap space Brad would probs bring back Edmundson. Didnt mind him these playoffs and if he signs a 2.4m x 2 year deal I got 0 objection. Main issue was just couldnt easily move the puck and blue line was not great for generating offense or being a threat offensively

If they can combine physicality with puck-movement they set

But I think based on Brads comments on a lack of scoring one of Skeji, Montour or Walker is probably coming with emphasis on Walker due to price and with Tanev those are not 2 bad additions. And that's probs where the money is going
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May 11 at 4:11 p.m.
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Edited May 16 at 3:09 p.m.
For those who argue the core can still work will show roster construction since JT entered and highlight why over the 6 years it had not worked and why trimming around the edges again dump

2018-2019

Johnsson-Matthews-Nylander
Hyman-JT-Marner
Marleau-Kadri-Kapenan
Ennis-Gauthier-Brown

Rielly-Hainsey
Muzzin-Zaistev
Gardiner-Dermott

Anderson
Hutchinson

Lost in 7 to BOS


2019-2020 (Babcock out Keefe in)

Hyman-Matthews-Marner
Mikheyev-JT-Nylander
Johnsson-Kerfoot-Kapenan
Engvall-Gauthier-Spezza

Rielly-Ceci
Muzzin-Holl
Dermott-Barrie

Anderson
Campbell

Lost in play-in tournament in 5 to CBJ

2020-2021 (Canadian division)

Hyman-Matthews-Marner
Galchenyuk-JT-Nylander
Engvall-Kerfoot-Mikheyev
Thorton-Spezza-Foligno

Rielly-Brodie
Muzzin-Holl
Sandin-Bogosian

Campbell
Anderson

Lost in 7 to MTL (blew a 3-1 series lead)

2021-2022

Bunting-Matthews-Marner
Kerfoot-JT-Nylander
Engvall-Kampf-Mikheyev
Kase-Blackwell-Spezza

Rielly-Lybushkin
Muzzin-Brodie
Giordano-Liligren

Campbell
Mrazek

Lost in 7 to TBL

2022-2023

Bunting-Matthews-Marner
Jarnkrok-JT-Nylander
Knies-ROR-Acciari
Kerfoot-Kampf-Lafferty

Rielly-Schenn
McCabe-Brodie
Gio-Liligren

Samsonov
Murray

Won in 6 vs. TBL, lost in 5 to FLA


2023-2024

Bertuzzi-Matthews-Domi
Knies-JT-Marner
Jarnkrok-Holmberg-Nylander
Dewar-Kampf-Gregor

Rielly-Lybushkin
Benoit-McCabe
Edmundson-Liligren

Samsonov
Woll

Out in 7 vs. BOS

Notice all the trimming around these big 4, all the various Dman and goaltenders heck even a changed coach and the results have almost stayed the same. Can go into more detail but yea no more trimming time to hit the bullseye at the center. Time for one or two of the big 4 to go

As you just cannot build a balanced team 2024-2025 with all of them there
May 11 at 10:44 p.m.
#61
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How about those London Knights
May 12 at 8:16 a.m.
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Quoting: NorthernLeafsFan05
How about those London Knights


At both games with a buddy. Just having an absolute blast (although the third was kind of boring since no one was trying lmao)

Love this team so damn much
May 12 at 2:05 p.m.
#63
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Not interested in Zadarov, hes a hi-end 3rd pair to me that is luxury.

Not interested in Tanev, worried about the mileage on this guy.

Give me Roy at 6 and Montour at 7 for the D.


I have an idea on goalie, been afraid to say it out loud.
Hypothetically if Boston traded Ullmark to Utah, in a Marner trade...

Marner
Reaves

For

Doan
Ullmark at 50% retention
2nd rounder x2

Whose on board
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May 12 at 3:05 p.m.
#64
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Quoting: Trickster
Not interested in Zadarov, hes a hi-end 3rd pair to me that is luxury.

Not interested in Tanev, worried about the mileage on this guy.

Give me Roy at 6 and Montour at 7 for the D.


I have an idea on goalie, been afraid to say it out loud.
Hypothetically if Boston traded Ullmark to Utah, in a Marner trade...

Marner
Reaves

For

Doan
Ullmark at 50% retention
2nd rounder x2

Whose on board


7 for Montour would be BRUTAL, imo. The guy has one crazy outlier season and honestly isn't much of a puck mover/creator despite his reputation. He's a volume chance guy, lots of low percentage stuff from him from what I've seen.

Would also be taking a hard pass on the Marner deal. No chance I trade him for a package centered around pretty much any goalie, let alone a 31y/o who's pretty much been a solid tandem guy for the vast majority of his career.
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May 12 at 3:31 p.m.
#65
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Edited May 12 at 3:41 p.m.
Quoting: Trickster
Not interested in Zadarov, hes a hi-end 3rd pair to me that is luxury.

Not interested in Tanev, worried about the mileage on this guy.

Give me Roy at 6 and Montour at 7 for the D.


I have an idea on goalie, been afraid to say it out loud.
Hypothetically if Boston traded Ullmark to Utah, in a Marner trade...

Marner
Reaves

For

Doan
Ullmark at 50% retention
2nd rounder x2

Whose on board


So I have wanted Roy and stuff but those two contracts would hurt IMO

Then for Marner for Ullmark pass. That would not be a good trade for us as I dont see Ullmark being the answer. He's a nice goalie but I dont see him as the better of a matchup against Swayman, Vasilesky, Bobrosky, etc.


Dman I see Brad targeting this summer

Dillon
Demelo
Walker

But would also not be surprised to see Lybushkin or Edmundson return

If Marner's traded look at a Eichel deal or a Tkachuck deal. If were targeting a goalie go for Saros or Sorokin
May 12 at 4:45 p.m.
#66
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Its kind of funny how when looking at Marner trades two teams that make sense and work in terms of comparable packages are within the division

OTT and BUF

Meanwhile the more realistic teams be in the Pacific/Central lul

NSH, SEA, VGK
May 12 at 5:24 p.m.
#67
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Guess I should have checked this thread sooner LoL.

Quoting: NorthernLeafsFan05
Keefes post game comment was enough to send me back here for one last angry tirade against that pathetic excuse for a head coach.

For you guys who haven't seen the quote, it goes as follows: "When teams beat the Leafs, they set up the game for the Leafs to beat themselves"

Pretty choice wording here. First off, whose job is it to make sure the team sticks to the system? Whose job is it to adapt and manage the team? Whose job is it to react when teams start applying pressure? Whose job is it to keep your players heads straight? THATS YOUR JOB SHELDON. Actually, let me back it up; that used to be your job Sheldon. Kiss your spot on the bench goodbye and don't let the door hit you on the ass on your way out. You have done nothing for the Leafs and won't do anything for any other NHL teams unless they are looking to tank. If only your bulldog-like appearance also translated to a bulldog-like mentality. You can blame the players for sure, but YOU are just as big of a part of this team as they are, and YOU are largely to blame for this team setting themselves up for failure. Who decides to put the 4th line out at critical points in the game? Who decides to play Samsonov when it's abundantly clear Woll should play? Who decides to keep going back to the same old tactics that always fail? THATS YOU, SHELDON.

In good news, Keefes wording is pretty specific. He distances himself from the team, which is hopefully an indication of his inevitable departure from this team. We deserve so much better than some pathetic excuse for a head coach who thinks he's all that because he used to front as a tough guy back in the early 2000s. He thinks he's all that because the Marlies stacked team walked their way to a Calder Cup. My only hope is that this born loser is hired by another Atlantic division team so we can beat up on them in the first round.

Keefe is a coward who does not know hockey. He doesn't take any sort of accountability, gives a pass to our best players when they disappear, and rips into our other players when they occasionally make minor mistakes. Hope you enjoyed your time in the sun Sheldon, because you will never be a name anyone remembers outside of reminiscing about the Leafs plights prior to our Cup win. You will go down as a laughing stock and a detriment. Enjoy unemployment Sheldon


Well said. To add to your spirited post I'll say that it really undermined Keefe's creditabily with media, fans and probably most importantly the players when he walked back comments he made 2-3 times during his time as the coach. Nevermind the media or fans for a second but just the players...how can they take you seriously if you're critical of them one moment and then walking them back the next day when Mr. God Complex himself probably got pissy about it.

Anyway, a rookie coach was the wrong decision (yes Keefe was a rookie coach when he took over) for this market at the time.

No more coach excuses.
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May 12 at 5:52 p.m.
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Quoting: LeafsFanForSomeReason
7 for Montour would be BRUTAL, imo. The guy has one crazy outlier season and honestly isn't much of a puck mover/creator despite his reputation. He's a volume chance guy, lots of low percentage stuff from him from what I've seen.

Would also be taking a hard pass on the Marner deal. No chance I trade him for a package centered around pretty much any goalie, let alone a 31y/o who's pretty much been a solid tandem guy for the vast majority of his career.


Quoting: aadoyle
So I have wanted Roy and stuff but those two contracts would hurt IMO

Then for Marner for Ullmark pass. That would not be a good trade for us as I dont see Ullmark being the answer. He's a nice goalie but I dont see him as the better of a matchup against Swayman, Vasilesky, Bobrosky, etc.


Dman I see Brad targeting this summer

Dillon
Demelo
Walker

But would also not be surprised to see Lybushkin or Edmundson return

If Marner's traded look at a Eichel deal or a Tkachuck deal. If were targeting a goalie go for Saros or Sorokin


Do you not see any value in the cap space back along with Doan plus picks?

Ullmark at 2.5 million on 1 year is better than the free agent options
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May 12 at 5:57 p.m.
#69
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Edited May 12 at 6:05 p.m.
Quoting: Trickster
Do you not see any value in the cap space back along with Doan plus picks?

Ullmark at 2.5 million on 1 year is better than the free agent options


Sure Ullmark is better but why not just trade for an actual difference maker goalie like Saros or Sorokin via Marner?

As Tree put it why dont we have the better goalie in net vs. our opponent

Doans interesting but we have a very small sample size for him. What if next year he struggles.

TOR should be eyeing a trade similar to Tkachuck with emphasis on a starting goalie and top 4 RD thats what I would target
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May 12 at 6:12 p.m.
#70
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Quoting: Trickster
Do you not see any value in the cap space back along with Doan plus picks?

Ullmark at 2.5 million on 1 year is better than the free agent options


Tbh, I find cap space to be overrated because it entirely matters how you spend it and the best players you're likely to find to use that cap space on are probably the guys you could return in a Marner trade. For instance you mentioned signing Montour for 7. That's a distinct possibility. Would I be happy trading Marner for Ullmark, Montour, and a few 2nds (including Doan in that)? HELL NO. That's such a quantity over quality return.
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May 12 at 6:56 p.m.
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Quoting: aadoyle
Sure Ullmark is better but why not just trade for an actual difference maker goalie like Saros or Sorokin via Marner?

As Tree put it why dont we have the better goalie in net vs. our opponent

Doans interesting but we have a very small sample size for him. What if next year he struggles.

TOR should be eyeing a trade similar to Tkachuck with emphasis on a starting goalie and top 4 RD thats what I would target


Saros is fine but he will be costly in trade with little else included, plus his lack of size doesn't worry you?

Sorokin is a fantasy, Islanders trading him... I'll believe it when it happens regardless of the playoff events


I'm not stuck on Ullmark by any means, nor am I on Montour.
Roy I want, any thoughts on another D man with a shot? Yes we need this on the team cause Rielly don't have one.
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May 12 at 7:02 p.m.
#72
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Edited May 12 at 7:08 p.m.
Quoting: Trickster
Saros is fine but he will be costly in trade with little else included, plus his lack of size doesn't worry you?

Sorokin is a fantasy, Islanders trading him... I'll believe it when it happens regardless of the playoff events


I'm not stuck on Ullmark by any means, nor am I on Montour.
Roy I want, any thoughts on another D man with a shot? Yes we need this on the team cause Rielly don't have one.


Saros has done fine in the league despite his size. For a goalie that does not worry me its Dman to where its a concern

I do not care for cost at this point as TOR needs to get their goaltending straightened out

We have Woll whose injury prone and were expecting 40 games out of him next year, 0 idea what we have in Hildeby, and the UFA market sucks. Sure we can trade for Ullmark or sign Talbot but Brad said it best in that presser "we dont want to have the second best goalie in a series" Ullmark would be that vs. Swayman, Vasi, and Bobrosky.

Go invest in a legit starter.
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May 12 at 7:04 p.m.
#73
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Quoting: Trickster
Saros is fine but he will be costly in trade with little else included, plus his lack of size doesn't worry you?

Sorokin is a fantasy, Islanders trading him... I'll believe it when it happens regardless of the playoff events


I'm not stuck on Ullmark by any means, nor am I on Montour.
Roy I want, any thoughts on another D man with a shot? Yes we need this on the team cause Rielly don't have one.


I'd at least talk to Lou and see where the organization stands with Sorokin because they also added Roy as the coach who chose to play the other guy.
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May 12 at 7:09 p.m.
#74
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Quoting: aadoyle
Saros has done fine in the league despite his size. For a goalie that does not worry me its Dman to where its a concern

I do not care for cost at this point as TOR needs to get their goaltending straightened out

We have Woll whose injury prone and were expecting 40 games out of him next year, 0 idea what we have in Hildeby, and the UFA market sucks. Sure we can trade for Ullmark or sign Talbot but Brad said it best in that presser "we dont want to have the second best goalie in a series" Ullmark would be that vs. Swayman, Vasi, and Bobrosky.

Go invest in a legit starter.


Do you agre we need a D with shot?
At least a threat, whose in your list for this?
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May 12 at 7:11 p.m.
#75
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Quoting: oneX
I'd at least talk to Lou and see where the organization stands with Sorokin because they also added Roy as the coach who chose to play the other guy.


Regardless of playoff events like I said, Sorokin is their future.
Remind me again on Varlamov age please, 35+?
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